Ok guys, I am still trying to decide what is the best way to go for my situation. I am looking for an amp that will power 2 PV118's that also has a built in crossover. Right now I have an older cs400s bridged to power one sub. It sounds good to me, but I would like to power both cabinets. So, it apears to me that I either need an amp that has at least 400 watts per side at 8 ohms, or 800 watts ( bridged ) at 4 ohms. ( running the 118's daisy chained with 800 watts would give me 400 watts at 4 ohms each correct ? ) The 118's are rated at 400 watts at 8 ohms ( program ). It needs to either have a built in crossover on each channel or one that can be used in bridge mode.
My setup will be this. Run a line out of a XR8600 ( or possible 8300 ) to the power amp with the built in crossover. From that power amp ( speaker outputs ) to the subs. A line back from that amp to the "power amp input" on the XR8600. Then run the tops from the 8600 "mains" side and the monitors off the "monitor" side. Does this make sense ?
I hope I have this correct because I don't fully understand the watts/ohms thing. I am going off of the great info that I have gotten here on this site. I appreciate all the help I can get. Thank you

The PV-2600 is probably your best bet if you want it all in one box. 540w/channel into an 8 ohm load, so you don't have to bridge and make the amp work hard. It has a built in 150hz low pass so there is your crossover. $600 new, ~$450 used.

More expensive but more industrial and expandable option would be to get an analog crossover (PV 23XO) and a CS-2000. Will give you more flexibility down the road. $700 for the amp and $100 for the crossover.

My $0.02
Steve

Steve, Thank you very much. I had actually been looking at that one. My question is how would I hook it up with the setup I mentioned ? Since I will only have one line comming out of the XR8600 to the pv2600, how will I get the signal to both channels ? Then, what about a line back to the XR8600 to power the top cabinets ? Thanks again for all your help.

55FMJ,
You need to go fishing again in your owner's manual.

How many "amplified outputs" do you have? ____________
How many "un-amplified outputs" do you have? __________
Do they both work simultaneously? _________

Steve

Steve, I have done some fishing and I may have a few bites !
According to the XR8600 manual, it appears that I can run a line out from the "main out" to the input of channel A in the PV2600. Then on the PV2600 I can run a line on channel A that says "high out" back to my "power amp 1 in" on the XR8600. Then the powered outputs on the back of the 8600 "should" only be getting the higher frequencies correct ? My question now is how do I also get the low signal to channel B on the PV2600 so I can run the subs on both channels ? Also, How much of a difference is there between my old crossover of 100hz versus the 150 hz crossover on the new PV2600 ?
Since this is basically how I have been running it with my older Peavey equipment, I would assume it will still work with the new equipment but I was hoping that someone who was familiar with Peavy stuff might be able to give me some insight. I know I have a lot of questions, but I just want to make sure that if I go buy some more equipment that I will know how to hook it up correctly and that it will do what I want it to do. Thank you for your patience with me ! I appreciate it.

Edited to add : I have been doing some more studying of the PV2600 manual and I think I have answered my own question. After hooking everything up as previously stated, I think I see what needs to be done to get the signal to channel B. The 1/4 "thru low out" jack on channel A can be patched to the channel B input and then engage the crossover swith on channel B to send the lows to the main powered output on the PV2600. Does all this sound correct ?

Correct

Ok, I am getting somewhwere. Thank you all for bearing with me. My only concern with this now is the 150hz built in crossover point. I get mixed responses from people on this being too high. Right now I am at 100hz on my current cs400 amp and it sound fine to me. Any thoughts ?

150 will sound fine too.
If you like, get the big chart of instruments and frequencies. Look at what instruments you are putting through the PA and how low they go. See what really is coming out at below 100 and below 150. I'm sure you'll find that 100-150 is not that much different. In fact, if you have proper amplification on your subs, you may want more coming out down there and free up the freq band for the tops.

Steve

I have another question. Would a power amp that has 300 watts per channel at 8 ohms power the pv 118's at a decent ( and safe ) level ? I see the program rating is 400 but the continuous is 200. When I run 200 watts through them they just sound like they need a "little more." Whe I run 420 or so through one of them it sounds really good but I have been told that is too much for those subs. Any thoughts ? Thank you

Do you know for a fact that you actually put 420 watts into the speaker? How so? For how long? A brief instant or sustained? Did you use a 1khz sine wave or musical selections? Who told you it was too much? Did they measure sustained 57.965 volts at the amps' output? Did they measure the woofer's excursions?

I really would like to know what was the basis for their statement. If "they" have an easy way to do this, I am ready to listen.

10 log 420/400 = 0.2 db difference. Uh, yeah...again, who says it's too much?

The speakers' program rating is a good rule of thumb "target" level to match an amplifier. A bit more or a bit less is fine. Please read this if you haven't already:
http://www.peavey.com/support/technotes ... _POWER.pdf
Also read the article on what the terminology means. I think you are misinterpreting the meanings of 'continuous', 'program' and 'peak'. On that same tech note page, there are a few articles dealing with bridging amps as well.

Keep learning!
Steve

Steve, once again let me say that I really appreciate all your help. My knowledge of all of this is very limited ( as I'm sure you can tell ) and I am just trying to figure out what is the best ( and least expensive ! ) way for me to go.
You had originally told me that by bridging my peavey cs400 that I would be sending 420 watts to my one pv118 sub. Originally I was powering two 118's from that bridged cs400 which was giving me 200 watts at 8 ohms per sub. It sounded ok but I thought it needed a little more. When I took your advice to power just the one sub ( which you said was about 420 watts ) there was a noticable difference. I thought it sounded good.
Now my quest has been for a new power amp that will power both subs. I have been looking at a QSC GX3 or GX5 ( I know, I know, it's not peavey ). They appear to be a decent entry level amp with a pretty good track record, not to mention they are in my budget. By they way, I have taken everyone's advice ( including yours ) and I am going to purchase a separate peavey crossover instead of trying to get an amp with one in it.
The GX3 is rated at 300 watts at 8 ohms per side and the GX5 is rated at 500 watts at 8 ohms per side. I was leaning towards the GX5 but have had several other people from another music forum tell me that the GX5 would be way too much for the pv118's and I should go with the GX3. I am perfectly ok with that but I seem to be getting conflicting opinions on what I should be running to the pv118's.
These subs are run for a typical 4 hour gig. In the past, they have been used for a 3 and 4 piece country/rock band, but now they are going to be used for just myself with an acoustic guitar. ( possibly another guitar, bass, and drum unit from time to time )
As you are a respected member of this board with extensive knowledge on the subject, I would value your opinion on this. So, what is the ideal watts that I should be running these subs with ? Would 300 watts be enough, or should I be looking for something in the 400 watt range ? Thank you so much for all the help you have given me so far.

It is hard to keep up when Grasshopper morphs into Butterfly.

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=9499

See my last post.

Okay,
From Marty (edited for spelling) in one of the several threads you initiated:
"So what you may have heard as an improvement from lower power was an increase in headroom. However you just can not put an amplifier on a loudspeaker that is 10 times more powerful than the continuous rating, as most people would blow up the loudspeaker in a very short time. This is why we recommend using an amplifier that is rated at least as powerful as the continuous rating, but no more than the program rating. Even then the operator needs to maintain some degree of system headroom."

This is VERY sage advice and I am not going to contradict it.
Peavey doesn't have a handy 400w/8ohm amp.
They do have a nice 330w/8ohm amp - it's called a CS-1400 - which puts you right in the middle of the continuous /program specs.

If you are dead set on the GX series, if it were me, I would get the GX5. A few reasons:
- the 500w/8ohm number is a 1Khz spec, not a 20-20khz spec, so the actual power rating for full range will be lower - probably in the neighborhood of 450-475 (that's a swag, get QSC on the line and get the real number).
- I know I would be upgrading down the road - but I also have a limiter I would use to keep the 118 from flying out of the enclosure.

Other options:
- The QSC RMX 1850 @ 350/8 20-20k
- The QSC PLX 2502 @ 425/8 20-20khz

Keep a straight flight path....
Steve

I wish Marty would let me know when he is typing at the same time I am on the same thread....

Just out of curiosity. ( I actually just posted this on another topic ) On my pv118's, it says on the back "350" watts rated program power ( 8 ohms ). The online manual says 400. Why is there a difference ? If mine truely are 350 (program) would the 300 watt amp be a better choice ? Thank you ( both Steve and Marty )